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Why and when did you get involved in radical green politics?

For about 10 years I have been involved with the issue of radical environmentalism, along with neo-Luddism, anti-civilization, etc., back then I was young and positive, then seeing all the crudity of this world, these thoughts seemed to me like reformists and I considered that no organization of that kind gave accurate blows to the central problem that is civilization.
So, I directed my way towards something more violent, something that caused an impact not only in the media aspect but in the chosen target, I decided to revive along with other accomplices the modus operandi of Mr. Kaczinski, but in the same way it seemed to me that it was falling In the same way, having an optimistic look towards his anti-industrial revolution, all his postulates fell by its own weight, because he was fighting for something that I do not know if it would one day be valid if it materialized, I was fighting blindly as the did communists who never saw their long-awaited revolution triumph, or like the anarchists who never saw their anarchist revolution triumph as they expected. So I rejected this idea and undertook a trip to the Ancient Great Chichimeca, without money or anything, I visited mountains in thick forests where the secrets of the ancients dwell, I hunted, I gathered, I made fire with my hands, I felt the peace and conflict of the wild and saw beautiful things, and things that filled me with hatred towards modern humanity. I made this trip to find vision and during my stay I met several people, all inhabitants of the hills and forests, mostly natives who filled me with wisdom, they told me the feats of the warriors killed by the invaders, and they confined me a mission, to relive the conflict that was pending, but not only against the invader 500 years ago, but now against everything else, against everything that has been ending the wilderness. I promised myself and I swore to my ancestors that I would be one of the factors that would throw this artificial reality into the abyss, I became part of the Chaos and declared War on Human Progress.
Of course, this does not fit within the “radical green politics” since it goes beyond ecologism, that is why I baptized this trend as eco-extremism, since this version is much more committed, it implies a blood pact, a cult towards the Occult and cries out for revenge, the one that is never forgotten and that is paid for with death and injuries.

You are one of the first members of ITS, How was it formed? Continue reading 9 INTERVIEW

[en] (International) 94 Communique of ITS

We believe that it is always necessary and positive for any project to advance that there is a constant self-criticism, reflection and analysis of the different questions that arise around a specific project, even more so to one like ours.

The time has come to position ourselves and clarify some issues that have been constantly on the lips of some, sometimes more and sometimes less, and lately it seems that they are back in fashion. There have always been among our many detractors those who have supported the idea that ITS is a false group that does not even exist, or that works for the government, or that claims false actions that never occurred or were carried out by others, etc.

First things first, if this situation has been reached, it is not only because there are individuals or groups of despicables who do not lose a single opportunity to vomit their infamy cowardly, but that mistakes have been made that have made it possible for this kinds of “criticism” have found some “legitimacy”.

A project like that of ITS, due to its characteristics, where different cells and individuals distributed around the world who do not know each other, together with the provocative style of eco-extremist theory and practice, added to that aura of mystery and mysticism that surrounds everything that has to do with the eco-extremist tendency and with ITS, it easily gives rise to people outside the tendency, whether they are crude attempts by the police intelligence services, or attempts to discredit us by those who oppose the trend or either by individuals seeking their dose of adrenaline and feeling important, try to appropriate or take advantage of the project and at the same time undermine it, each with different purposes.

Similarly, this occurs (or has the potential to occur) in virtually any similar project (in the illegal aspect at least), be it anarchist action groups, communist guerrillas, religious sects, neo-Nazi terrorists, or organized crime groups. There is always the possibility that there is an attempted police infiltration, a provocation by political rivals or some internet coward who without having touched a weapon in his life or having felt the tension of loading and placing a bomb in the middle of a crowded city ​​want to have a dose of prominence at the same time that they feel “dangerous” and part of a tendency, of which they clearly are NOT part. And whoever has a memory, both of past and recent times, will soon find a multitude of cases of false statements and claims, of any tendency, as well as surely they have met someone who was dedicated to go around pretending to be who he was not. We are aware that this occurs in all environments, and personally to us in our past experience within anarchic action groups we are 100% aware that there were (and still are) cases of these, even in more than one case there still are claims of responsibility that was already proven to be false, and still being upload on pages of anarchist “counter-information”. In the same way, we are also aware of the sincere efforts of a part of that tendency to clear its name of phonies and provocateurs, uncovering falsehoods and phonies.

From the ME blog, dubious groups or statements have been given a voice and sometimes this has led to feeding this type of rumor mill against us, we believe there has been too loose criteria when it comes to filtering what is published and what not, but at the same time, from what we have explained above, with this type of project it is difficult to discern between what should be published and what not, and it has always been decided to give the benefit of the doubt, as long as they were not obviously false claims.

At the same time, constant work has been carried out by ME to dismantle the infiltration and falsification attempts of the tendency, alleged groups that turned out to be false have been discovered and exposed, such as the case of the “group” that was called ” shadows of the forests” in Mexico, although they have not been the only case or attempted interference by others in the tendency. After all, as we have already said, this seems inevitable to us.

On the other hand, the obvious can’t be denied no matter how hard some characters insist. Many responsibility claims from ITS and other groups of the eco-extremist tendency around the world have been accompanied by graphic documents such as pictures of the devices, even some actions have been recorded on video, data and details have been given, for example of the composition of the devices, how, when and where they were placed… and other details that can ONLY be known by those who actually carried out the action. A multitude of press releases and police investigations regarding ITS attacks or other groups of the same tendency have also been attached, although at the end of the day we know that the press publishes what it wants and many of the attacks have been deliberately silenced and hidden.

Be that as it may, we are not going to change the foolishness of the habitual idiots, there are people who continue and will continue to insist on covering the sun with a finger. We believed that it was necessary to position ourselves on this issue and we have done so. At the end of the day, everyone will believe what they want to believe, meanwhile, members of ITS and supporters of the eco-extremist tendency spread across various countries in both America and Europe remain free, active and preparing their next movements from the shadows.

For Chaos:
Individualists Tending Towards the Wild (Europe)
Individualists Tending Towards the Wild (America)

[en] (USA) Reivindicación de acciones violentas durante los disturbios de las últimas semanas en Estados Unidos

Enviado al mail.

Protesters set fires at the 3rd Precinct of the Minneapolis Police Department, Thursday, May 28, 2020, in Minneapolis. Violent…

The media likes to talk about how some protests like “Black Lives Matter” are used as an excuse for violent groups that only want to bring Chaos. Leftists rage at this, they claim it’s only a minority, that are isolated cases, etc. Of course, leftists are wrong. Peaceful protests are the best cover for us, the perfect scenario to unleash our destructive impulses against all that stands in our way. Be it infrastructure, police, protesters, by passers, it’s all the same.

We don’t care if you don’t like us, our own lives are an act of rejection against the very concept of getting along and we exist to remind you of all the things that haunt you in your worst nights of distress and sorrow. The dream of a brotherhood binding all mankind has failed, our species is walking straight towards the abyss and this is NO tragedy. Because at the end of the day, we were never as important as we wanted to believe.

That’s why we were in the streets of minneapolis and didn’t hesitate to throw the first rocks at the third precinct (police station) as the “black pacifists” begged us to keep it peaceful. We were the “black” & “brown” nihilists infiltrating the protests with the sole intent on doing whatever we wanted, instigating chaos. The “outside agitators” the media talked about so much.

We are not your “comrades” and besides being among the instigators and the first stone tossers at the third precinct we also met anyone attempting to extinguish fires with violence. We attacked anarchists, black lives matter supporters and marxists alike that stood in our way of destruction.

We live in a world filled with weak people, claiming their right to exist as if it was granted by birth as some sort of privilege that only applies to our species. But we remind you with our violence that such right does not exist beyond your own abstractions, and as the structures of this system start to crumble, your pathetic lives will fall too if you don’t learn how to defend yourselves. Because outside of this fake world of comfort and security, nobody really cares if your are white, black, brown, gay, straight or whatever. If you don’t have the strength and the courage needed to defend your own life, someone stronger than you will come and take it. That’s why we no longer expect the State or any other institution to guard our safety, we chose to arm ourselves and self-defense as the only alternative. If you want to keep offering your heads as target practice for the cops, go ahead, we will continue our development in the shadows.

a group of people standing in front of a building: Police work to keep demonstrators back during a protest on May 31, 2020 in Washington, DC. Tasos Katopodis/Getty Images

If you fell for the illusion that this sudden revolt would bring something “new” or “better”, get ready to be disappointed when the current order imposes itself again. Keep on with your eternal cycle of hope and disbelief that will never get you anywhere. And then cry for the loss of more of your people in the hands of the police, white-supremacists, or whomever, peacefully contemplating the ever existing cycle of violence.

Our rifles are waiting for the moment to spit lead.

Neither anarchists nor leftists. Anti-political, amoral and indiscriminate.

-Armed Negativity

View image on Twitter

[en] (INTERNATIONAL) 93 Communique of ITS


“There is no end to this war that we wage, there is no end to the confrontation, this is inherited from generation to generation, and before this monster with a thousand heads there is no certainty that we can defeat it. In this sense ITS is pessimistic but realistic at the same time, there is nothing to win, because whoever plans to win from that moment has already lost. Many do not understand this logic, they continue with the same vision of the seventies guerrilla, who yearned to win his war and establish a revolution which always turned into reform, we do not want a change of power, we do not want the overthrow of civilization for the reign of nature (as the primitivist fools want it), because although that may occur in a few hundred years, we do not see it achievable today, that is why we only want chaos within civilization, we do not want to gain anything nor defeat civilization (apart from the fact that it is practically impossible for a group of individuals to do such a thing), we only have to destabilize, make despair and madness reign, we wage an individual war, and in that sense we win it when We come out safe and sound from an attack, when we strike the stab or the bullet at the target and it dies, that is when the ego of the individualist rises and is exalted with the action, but this remains at the individual level and does not go beyond (…) we live in the present and under extreme conditions, extremist responses.”

This quote summarizes one of our main theoretical bases, we have made it clear many times, we have assumed that we cannot win, that even with all our attacks we could never even knock down a partial part of the system or do great damage to it. Every material target destroyed by fire or explosives is promptly rebuilt and put into operation again. Every scientist, investigator, policeman, or common citizen we hurt or kill is promptly replaced by another. And so the wheel of progress and the social machine keeps turning, impassive to everything that happens, until at some point, whether due to its own unsustainability or other causes, everything falls into the abyss. That we are aware of all this and assume it as an unflappable reality does not imply that we are not aware of what surrounds us, of the changes that are taking place in the sick society in which we live and of the opportunities that are offered to us.

The events of the last months do nothing but confirm that civilization and the world we know has entered a period of decline, this is certainly not something new but it is at times like this when it is most accentuated and becomes very obvious. The imposed order is faltering, the economies are collapsing, the authoritarian tendencies of the governments are increasing at the same time that massive insurrections are breaking out, social tension is exploding and now a virus is causing a global pandemic that not all of its technological, human or all its convoluted bureaucracy, quarantines and closings of entire countries have managed to stop, the modern and civilized human being trembles before the dark present-future that is coming, everyone wonders how it is possible that this has happened and nobody knows with certainty what is to come .

What does seem certain is that troubled times are coming, the system has given evident signs of its multiple failures and imperfections, of course we do not know for sure what will happen, we do not know if there will be a global financial collapse of which the world do not recover, we do not know if the coronavirus pandemic will end in a few months or on the contrary it will become a true threat to civilization and human life even more serious than it already is, what we do know is that there is a before and a later in the world as we know it and even if it ends up returning to normality, we believe that nothing will ever be the same.


Humanity trembles before COVID19, something so insignificant for modern humans, it has made us remember the fragility of human life, the fragility of civilization and the supposed glory of humanity, of everything that exists by the hand of man and it has made them all tremble before the onslaught of a microscopic natural element.

Now we are flooded with speeches and propaganda, everywhere politicians, the media and celebrities lecture the masses anxious that someone come to fix their problems, they tell us that difficult times will come but that “all together” we will overcome it, that we have to tighten our belts to overcome this crisis and return to normalcy. Now many, especially from the petty-bourgeois middle classes, see how everything they took for granted suddenly disappears. They thought that living as dictated by the established, bowing their heads and obeying would have a good life, good studies, a good job and a good future, their own version of the “American dream”. But life is not a straight path already drawn on the map, but a chaotic path where you never know what will happen, the only thing we have is uncertainty.

Despite all the “negative” consequences that COVID19 may bring and directly affect us also (restriction of movement, increased social control, impoverishment or illness, including death for ourselves or someone we love… etc.) even with everything, is a scenario that we prefer an infinite number of times before returning to the normality of the worldly life of the civilized. Hard times do not scare us, in fact, we wish them, not only because they open many interesting possibilities for us (and not only for us) but because it is in the midst of disaster where we feel really comfortable. If the choice is between the normality of life in civilized society and barbarism, the choice is clear to us.


“Damn corner of the world, your infamy makes laugh at time with a mocking grimace and your misery has not softened any delicate heart desirous of funeral charms! Seen from the Balkans, the universe is a suburb through which syphilitic sluts and murderous gypsies stroll.
Its tremendous passion for trash, from stirring it joyous at the sound of funerany trumpets, it could not even invent a lustful god. What yearning star from the peripheries could have fallen there? Boisterous worms dancing the dance of leprosy!”

Now everything is green again, sightings of “strange” animals appear in cities and ports, the coasts are cleaned and the sea is crystalline or bioluminescent, they no longer emit large amounts of pollutants, the most disgustingly populated cities look lonely, the horizon no longer has that gray cream that prevailed a few months ago, the pandemic is NOT revealing a “new world”, it is revealing the world as it REALLY would be without all the negative consequences that we have caused. Wildness “celebrates” the human purge, manifesting as never before, 15 volcanoes erupting in America, Europe and Asia, a raging fire threats the old Chernobyl nuclear power plant, tornadoes destroying everything in its path in Texas, alert for extreme heat in different parts of the globe, and everything reveals the fragility of the human species, its pathetic and ephemeral existence. How right we misanthropes have been, us who bet on the disdain towards human progress! life can go on, continue its cycle without us, the proof is before your damn eyes and some still deny it, putrid humanists, vicious progressives of black mirrors with flashes of modernity, pestilent incubators of exacerbated sedentary lifestyle, we are NOT going to make any effort to return to normality, we are not going to work “all together” to overcome this or any other crisis, we do not want society to recover and return to the course of things. We are going to work, and very hard, to push everything off the cliff, to continue spreading chaos, to bring the situation to the worst of the worst.


Days of Chaos are coming, and it is there that individualists must focus their efforts and resources. Because although we have made it clear that we cannot win or destroy the techno-industrial civilization, its many faults and holes can be used by individualists like us to deliver accurate blows that contribute to plunging it even further into chaos and disorder. It does not take a fortune teller to predict what is coming upon humanity. And it is in this scenario as conducive to groups like ours where we incite all the individualists who are part of our acronyms around the world, and beyond our group all those who feel the call of the Wild, who long to see the Chaos scattered in every corner of the world, those who wait patiently for the moment to attack, those who live to provoke the social decline, to prepare, sharpen your knives, load your bullets, prepare your explosives, study your objectives, check your security practices and be vigilant for the moment of the escalation.

As we have said, the system has many flaws, and these offer many opportunities where it can be attacked to create great destabilization and even more so in the current times, we will leave to each individualist to choose and carefully study the objectives that please them, whether they are arson, murders, bombings or infiltrating the riots and insurrections that will undoubtedly explode in much of the planet and worsen in places where there is already a latent conflict. It matters little to us whether they try to silence us or ignore us, as they did with our communiqué where we claimed responsibility for the bomb at the Zografou police station in Greece, just as we do not care at all for the sterile criticism of right or left wing humanists bastards, nor of the anarcho-christians with their opportunistic double morality. We are here, we still alive, free and dangerous, we have not wasted our time. We are already doing our homework, and they will hear from us soon. When blood splashes onto the asphalt again, when the roar of the explosion shakes everyday normalcy and the fire devours its structures, a single name will come to your mind: ITS.


Individualists Tending Towards the Wild – Europe
Individualists Tending Towards the Wild – América

(en-pt) Entrevista con Guy McPherson acerca del Antropoceno y la Crisis Climática

Replicamos esta interesante entrevista realizada por un integrante del sitio web “Supremacía Ancestral”, sitio dedicado a estudiar el fenómeno del eco-extremismo y que se difunde en idioma portugués. En ella se abordan temas de suma importancia para la comprensión del estado actual del planeta en términos ecológicos. Aquí incluimos las versiones en inglés y portugués. También compartimos la traducción de la introducción realizada por el sitio de “Supremacía Ancestral”:

“Erva Daninha entrevista a Guy R. McPherson. Guy es un científico Américano, profesor emerito en recursos naturales, ecología y biología evolutiva en la Universidad de Arizona. Le agradecemos por esta entrevista con nosotros. Su sitio web es Nature Bats Last.”

Versión en Inglés:

DESCARGA en PDF: Link 1Link 2Link 3 (via onion).

Erva Daninha: First of all, we want to thank you for accepting this interview, Dr. Guy McPherson. Your scientific investigations into the climatic chaos within industrial civilization are of tremendous importance in pointing out the seriousness of the environmental crisis in the world caused by human activity.

So let’s begin, you are known for defending the idea of Near-Term Human Extinction (NTHE). Can you explain to us what NTHE is and what are the main ecological indicators that support this theory?

Guy R. McPherson: Thank you for the opportunity to engage with you and your audience.

Near-term human extinction (NTHE) as a result of abrupt climate change refers to the rapid demise of our species, Homo sapiens. I have predicted NTHE for many years, and I have recently been joined by others in my prediction.

Humans are animals. As with other animals, our species requires hábitat to survive. Specifically, humans are vertebrate mammals. Yet the projected rate of environmental change, using the gradual rate of change projected by the Intergovernment Panel on Climate Change (IPCC), outstrips the ability of vertebrates to adapt by a factor of 10,000 times (https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/abs/10.1111/ele.12144). Mammals will take millions of years to recover from the ongoing Mass Extinction Event (https://www.pnas.org/content/115/44/11262). I seriously doubt our species can avoid extinction even as non-human vertebrates and non-human mammals disappear.

At least seven species in the genus Homo have already gone extinct, even though none of those species were on Earth during a Mass Extinction Event. We are in the midst of a Mass Extinction Event. According to conservation biologist Gerardo Cellabos, lead author of a paper published 19 June 2015 in Science Advances indicating Earth is experiencing a Mass Extinction Event (https://advances.sciencemag.org/content/1/5/e1400253), “life would take many millions of years to recover, and our species itself would likely disappear early on.” (https://phys.org/news/2015-06-sixth-mass-extinction-declares.html). A paper with the same lead author published 25 July 2017 in the Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences indicates Earth is well into the ongoing Mass Extinction Event (https://www.pnas.org/content/114/30/E6089.short).

A paper in the November 2018 issue of Scientific Reports indicates a 5-6 C global-average rise in temperature will cause the extinction of all life on Earth (https://www.nature.com/articles/s41598-018-35068-1). Such an increase in global-average temperature is expected shortly after the Arctic Ocean become free of ice, an event incorrectly projected to occur in 2016 + 3 years in the 2012 issue of Annual Review of Earth and Planetary Sciences (https://www.annualreviews.org/doi/abs/10.1146/annurev-earth-042711-105345). Despite this incorrect projection, an ice-free Arctic looms on the near horizon.

Commercial air travel poses an existential threat to all life on Earth. According to a paper in the 27 June 2019 issue of Atmospheric Chemistry and Physics, contrails alone could eliminate habitat for most, if not all, life on Earth by disrupting atmospheric circulation patterns (https://www.atmos-chem-phys.net/19/8163/2019/). This conclusion is supported by a study published online 12 December 2019 in Earth and Space Science Open Archive (https://www.essoar.org/doi/10.1002/essoar.10501296.1).

The standard response to the ongoing climate crisis is to recommend a reduction in emissions of greenhouse gases. However, reduced industrial activity tranlates to an abrupt reduction in atmospheric aerosols. These aerosols reflect incoming solar radiation, thereby keeping Earth cooler than it would be without these aerosols. Research on the cooling effect of these aerosols has appeared in the peer-reviewed literature since 1929 (Angstrom, 1929, “On the atmospheric transmission of sun radiation and on dust in the air,” Geografiska Annaler, 11, 156–166). As little as a 20% reduction in industrial activity leads to a 1 C global-average temperature spike with a few weeks (Rosenfeld et al 2019, https://science.sciencemag.org/content/363/6427/eaav0566, and https://www.sustainability-times.com/environmental-protection/research-cooling-from-atmospheric-particles-may-mask-greater-warming/).

Erva Daninha: The well-known activist and writer Naomi Klein, unlike many climate deniers, argues that human activity is closely related to the climate crisis, however, she concentrates most of her efforts on painting capitalism as the great villain against the environment. Occasionally Naomi also criticizes the “industrial socialism” of some nations, but for the most part she defends the same thesis repeated by the great majority of leftists and ecologists around the world, “if we eliminate capitalism everything will be fine”. Dr. Guy, we believe that your criticisms are broader, they target the global industrial complex and not just a specific type of social order. Why do you think that the global technological-industrial society is the real problem and not just capitalism?

Guy R. McPherson: As pointed out with abundant research by Tim Garrett, civilization is a heat engine (https://faculty.utah.edu/u0294462-TIM_GARRETT/research/index.hml). In other words, this set of living arrangements produces heat. It matters little or not at all how industrial civilization operates. Solar panels and wind turbines heat the planet, just as burning fossil fuels. Civilization takes us to a Pliocene-style climate as early as 2030 (according to a paper in the Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences published 26 December 2018 that relies upon the IPCC’s stunningly conservative Representative Concentration Pathways, https://www.pnas.org/content/115/52/13288.short). I cannot imagine humans or other vertebrate mammals could survive such a rapid rate of change. Yet, as I pointed out above, slowing or stopping civilization heats the planet even faster than keeping civilization running.

Erva Daninha: Among many others scenarios, we have the utopian and hopeful views defended by Naomi Klein regarding eco-socialism as an alternative to “save the world” of an ecological catastrophe, or a delusional “primitivist revolution” against industrial civilization defended by anarchists like Kevin Tucker and John Zerzan. How efficient do you think these systems would be when the global census predicts almost 10 billion people on the planet for 2050? We live on a finite planet with limited resources and most of these resources have already disappeared, even a radical change towards a supposedly sustainable system would require other massive sources of energy, transportation or mass activities for food production, and even in more extreme cases like the “primitive utopia” defended by some anarchists, massive activity like feeding and housing, or whatever it may be, would have an enormous environmental impact on a large scale.

Nature tends to exercise a self-regulatory control over species on earth to enforce an organic coexistence, something that some call the trophic cascade, but our species has escaped this and has used the modern technology to its advantage to surpass the population control enforced by nature, manipulating its surroundings and expanding beyond its limit, whilst consuming nature indiscriminately and destroying great part of the limited resources on earth, all for it’s own benefit. Don’t you believe that there is overpopulation in the world and that our modern culture is alienated and decadent and that given the amount of billions of people in the world, any proposal to create a global sustainable society would be flawed?

Guy R. McPherson: As indicated above, I seriously doubt we survive until 2030, much less 2050. Too many humans have been consuming too many finite materials for far too long. We have severely overshot a sustainable population of humans on Earth.

Erva Daninha: You have stated on a number of occasions that the IPCC is quite conservative in its estimates. Do you believe that there is some kind of internal law within these entities or in the scientific community itself that establishes a pattern of behavior in order to avoid alarms that would have an impact on the economy or in society itself? For example, here in Brazil the National Institute for Space Research (INPE) released alarming data corroborated by NASA about the drastic increase of deforestation in the Amazon Rain forest in the year 2019, which resulted in the dismissal of Ricardo Galvão, director of the agency, at the behest of president Jair Bolsonaro. We believe that although they do warn about the climate crisis, these entities and most scientists operate within the same logic as that of the culture of industrial-technological civilization and defend the maintenance of this logic that in theory would be the essence of climatic chaos, then perhaps at the behest of governments (such was the case in Brazil), or by their own initiative, institutions handle their data carefully so as not to expose the infeasibility of this ecocidial social order. What do you think about this?

Guy R. McPherson: The IPCC uses a very conservative approach in creating their assessments. Scientists within working groups typically employ reticence in reaching their conclusions. After an assessment is drafted by conservative scientists who are required by the IPCC to rely upon consensus, the assessment is sent to governments for review. As you can probably imagine, the governments of the world are primarily interested in sustaining economic growth. “Saving the world” is not on the agenda.

Erva Daninha: Recently a Brazilian scientist revealed that Antarctica reached a surprising temperature of 20º C, something that was “never seen before”. Such temperatures are harsh examples of global warming. The consequences of the temperature rise in these frozen environments are already well known, the rise of the sea levels is widely discussed in the scientific community, but the effects of the melting are not restricted to it. Nature magazine has already published a study in which it states that Antarctica is possibly retaining colossal amounts of methane gas produced over thousands of years within its ice sheet and that if this gas were to be released, it would have an aggressive impact on the greenhouse effect. The same is true for the Arctic with permafrost, where the situation is perhaps even more serious, as the Arctic soil is no longer frozen. Studies indicate that the permafrost contains twice the total amount of carbon currently in the Earth’s atmosphere, and that a massive leak of this material would be catastrophic for life on Earth, even being able to cause a mass extinction like that of the Permian-Triassic period. Do you believe that the “clathrate gun” effect could really endanger most life on earth up until the year 2040?

Guy R. McPherson: Not only do I agree, but renowned climate scientist James Hansen has discussed this possibility. A peer-reviewed paper by Hansen and colleagues indicated Earth was at its highest temperature with our species present in 2017 (https://arxiv.org/abs/1609.05878). Indeed, methane emissions from beneath ice and also methane emissions from the melting permafrost represent two of seven means by which the planet could heat very quickly, thereby destroying hábitat for humans (https://weeklyhubris.com/seven-distinct-paths-to-loss-of-habitat-for-humans/).

Erva Daninha: In 2014 at an interview with Russia Today quoting a study by the climate scientist Tim Garrett you said that only the total collapse of industrial civilization could prevent uncontrolled climate change. For logical reasons, a solution based on this premise will never come from any government or institutions like the UN. On the contrary, the weak Paris Agreement has already been abandoned by the United States, the bigest emitter of greenhouse gases of all history, and the Brazilian State has also shown signs of its intents to abandon the agreement. Studies like the one of the Universal Ecological Fundation have already pointed out that the agreement won’t be enough to limit the temperature increase to between 1.5º C to 2º C in relation to the levels of the pre-industrial era. Assessments such as yours indicate the possibility of an increase of more than 3.5º C in a short period of time. Stopping industrial activities is unthinkable in the modern world, as this would mean to deny the very logic in which most countries are inserted in, however this does not mean that scenarios like this one are impossible to achieve, only not through the action of governments, of course.

At the end of last year, Houthis rebels attacked the world’s largest oil refinery in Saudi Arabia with drones, interrupting half of the kingdom’s production, which supplies 10% of all oil consumed in the world. Although extreme, this is a real example of the abrupt interruption of an activity that is harmful to the environment. Groups like the Niger Delta Avengers have also caused catastrophic damage to oil production in countries like Nigeria. Studies published by the magazine Science Advances also concluded that the war in the Middle East caused pollution to decrease in some areas of that region, because the levels of industrial activity decreased and activities of urban life such as driving were affected. Leaving aside all judgment that could be made regarding this type of action and considering the fact that urgent actions to interrupt industrial activity are needed and governments will never offer them, do you consider that there is practical efficiency in this type of action to interrupt pollutant emissions or destruction of the environment in the world? I say it again, I ask from a purely practical perspective, leaving aside the judgment as to whether it is legal or illegal.

Guy R. McPherson: Please see preceding information about the aerosol masking effect.

Erva Daninha:
Dr. Guy, the world is currently facing a COVID-19 pandemic, one of the most catastrophic in recent times. The attention is practically all focused on the economic damage caused by this situation, there is a lot of talk about a new economic recession in the world and a global financial crisis similar to that of 2008, but little is said about the benefits of this pandemic to the environment. You yourself said that total interruption of industrial activities are the most beneficial events that can contribute to the non-rise in global temperature and that is exactly what this disease is causing.

In China, there was a major paralysis of the economic activities and the reduction of polluting gases was huge and abrupt, in February this year the concentration of these gases was 25% lower compared to the same period last year, according to the Center for Research on Energy and Clean Air. In Italy, with tourism reduced to zero, the waters of the Grand Canal in Venice looked better and the air quality improved in the area, according to the city hall. Data from the Sentinela-5P satellite of the Copernican program at the European Commission and the European Space Agency (ESA) showed that in general terms pollution had a strong decrease in Italy, especially in the northern region of the country, the ones that were most affected by the virus. Certainly the same is repeating in various regions around the planet, and not only because industrial activities have been paralyzed or reduced, but also because tourism, transportation and many other daily activities within the technological-industrial civilization have ceased.

Based on this, how do you see these major disasters and their environmental benefits? We believe that they contribute in curbing the global climate crisis and indicate that, for the planet, our civilized lifestyle is just as bad as a pandemic to us. We also think that disasters can function as a self-regulating catharsis from the earth trying to dismantle the harmful modern lifestyle and the great techno-industrial civilization.

Guy R. McPherson: Actually, I have revised my assessment regarding the horrors of industrial civilization, as I have indicated above. Industrial civilization fouls the air, dirties the wáter, and washes soil into the ocean. Industrial civilization is a plague on the living planet. Yet, from the perspective of abrupt climate change, maintaining civilization helps to retain hábitat for humans on Earth. In our absence, the world’s nuclear power plants will melt down catastrophically, thereby leaving the planet bathing in ionizing radiation. I suspect such as event will destroy hábitat for all life on Earth within a few generations after the lethal mutations begin.

Erva Daninha: today we see the rise of a global “Green New Deal” through new movements like Extinction Rebellion and Sunrise Movement and also by climate activists such as Greta Thunberg. For the uninformed it looks like something new, but the same thing happened in past times with several NGOs, with emphasis on Greenpeace, which over the years reduced its activities to peaceful performances to be registered and disseminated on social media, campaigns to sign petitions to the government and an intense greenwashing activity to promote supposedly sustainable consumption.

The great eco-organizations of the past are promoting a discourse of “individual change to change the world”, the famous “do your part” activism, since they were accepted and incorporated within the very logic of the system that they criticized, such is the case for Greenpeace, which made pacts with oil, timber and fishing companies, in addition to many others. Extinction Rebellion has a very youthful and attractive appearance, the movement attracts enough people to shout against global leaders and demand changes in environmental policies around the world, respecting the limits that the order imposes on them, indirectly using the same logic that they oppose to and expecting from global leaders the longed-for changes in environmental policies, the same leaders who demonstrate that they are unable to comply with basic agreements like the one in Paris. Don’t you think that there is naivety in these movements and that instead of addressing the root of the problem they indirectly advocate for reforms and perpetuate the destructive industrial civilization? If they are not fighting for the end of industrial society, but for the existence of a “better industrial society”, wouldn’t this struggle be a big problem and a mere greenwashing?

Guy R. McPherson: These movements are exceptionally naive. As I indicated above, industrial civilization is a heat engine, but slowing or stopping industrial civilization heats the planet very quickly. This represents a classic Catch-22.

Erva Daninha: A UN report released last year, probably conservative in terms of numbers, said that one million species of animals and plants are at risk of extinction. The main cause indicated by the report is industrial agriculture, pollution and the warming of the oceans. Many scientists point towards the same, do you also believe that we are currently experiencing the sixth mass extinction? This would be the first human-made mass extinction, right? Would Anthropocene be a suitable term?

Guy R. McPherson: Earth is in the midst of the Seventh Mass Extinction. We have long believed we were in the Sixth Mass Extinction, but a paper published in the peer-reviewed Journal of Historical Biology on 5 September 2019 indicates an additional, previously unknown Mass Extinction Event (https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1080/08912963.2019.1658096). That minor point aside, the ongoing Mass Extinction Event is generally termed the Anthropocene Mass Extinction because it results from human activities (notably, industrial civilization).

Erva Daninha: Mark Boyce’s study published in the Journal of Mammalogy on the experience of reintroducing wolves in the Yellowstone National Park reinforced what many already knew, nature is interconnected and interdependent with the species that live in it, be it animals, plants, fungi, whatever it is. If a single animal disappears forever, the entire trophic cascade is destabilized and the consequences can be immeasurable.

Currently, all terrestrial biomes are threatened by the advance of civilization and the speed with which species are going extinct is a thousand times above normal, according to a study by University College London. This massive extinction endangers the life not only of the species, but of the biomes themselves. The marine biome, perhaps the most important one for life on earth, is rapidly disappearing. Insects vital to earth cycles, such as pollinators, also die in catastrophic quantities. Do you think that this massive extinction wave can reach the human species itself at some moment?

Guy R. McPherson: Several other species in the genus Homo have gone extinct. Indeed, all individuals die and all species go extinct. The 13 November 2018 peer-reviewed paper in Scientific Reports indicates all life on Earth will go extinct with the kind of temperature rise forecast in the near future, largely as a result of co-extinctions (https://www.nature.com/articles/s41598-018-35068-1). In other words, species such as ours that rely upon other species for our own existence, face an existential risk specifically because we depend upon other species. The ongoing insect apocalypse, the rapid rate of environmental change, and our membership as life forms on Earth guarantee our near-term demise.

Erva Daninha: You are sometimes singled out within the scientific community and within the world of ecological discourse as someone who is tremendously pessimistic and hopeless. We think of you as someone who is just realistic and well informed. It’s reality itself that’s pessimistic and full of bad news for humanity’s future. Last year a text called “Hope is a Mistake and a Lie” was published on your website, in which you destroy the hopeful behavior about the future of our species. Dr. Guy, don’t you think that there is a bitter difficulty within the scientific community, and among militants and activists, normally anarchists and leftists, to accept the reality about our future and understand the fact that better days will never come?

Us in particular are very realistic (and also pessimistic) about the future of our species and we believe that as humans we draw our own end and that we will reap the consequences of the ecocidal structure that homo-sapiens has erected. This allows us to deal with reality in the hardest, coldest and most necessary way. Naive activists shout for their political leaders to adopt new environmental policies, anarchists and leftists already seem to know that there is no way out, but they prefer to deny it with all their strength and cling to comfortable utopian dreams that can not be achieved. Hope is like a drug and these types of people are addicted, they cannot accept the dark days to come, so they run in circles, because to renounce hope would be to renounce humanity itself and everything it has created until today. What do you think about this?

Guy R. McPherson: The society has promulgated the idea that hope is universally good. I believed it for a long time. Then I looked up the definition of the word in the dictionary. As you indicated, I prefer reality to wishful thinking. And hope is one versión of wishful thinking.

Erva Daninha: Dr. Guy, what do you think about the anthropocentric perspective of the world? This type of thinking that places the human being at the center of everything and gives it more importance than other species is present even in the contemporary schools of thought that present a radical ecological critique, such is the case with eco-anarchism. We believe that the human being is just one more species among the thousands that exist, and perhaps is not even that important. The life-death cycle is constantly present in nature and it’s a part of the life of any living being, beings are being born and dying all the time. The modern human being denies death and always seeks to extend its existence. It is not wrong to say that the evolution of medicine, especially modern medicine, which has provided humans with such longevity, has caused them to mock natural selection and to expand at a very accelerated pace. Today the techniques of biotechnology and nanotechnology flirt with immortality. We believe that this type of thinking has also influenced humanity’s capability to reach a higher degree of ecocide on earth and it’s the basis for the values that support civilizations. What do you think about this?

Guy R. McPherson: I could not agree more. Homo sapiens represents one species among millions to occupy Earth. We have created environmental conditions contrary to the continuation of life on this beautiful planet. We strive for immortality at the level of individuals and at the level of our species. To the contrary, acceptance of one’s own death is a gift filled with peace. The same sentiment holds true at the level of our species.

Erva Daninha: Dr. Guy, is there a possibility that global warming could reveal to the world something as serious as the current coronavirus pandemic? Recent news showed that the melting in the Arctic and other frozen regions was resulting in the reappearance of bacteria and viruses considered to be extinct and also had the possibility of bringing back prehistoric bacteria and viruses of unknown pathogenic capacity. The magazine Scientific Reports has already published that the melting of the ice in the Arctic has released a virus normally found in the Atlantic that has contaminated sea otters in Alaska. We think that pathogenic super-microorganisms could, through the melting at the extreme poles of the earth, reach the coasts of several countries and start pandemic infections as occurred with the coronavirus on China, which could have started on a seafood market. Based on your experience as a researcher, do you believe that this possibility is real?

Guy R. McPherson: There is little question about the interaction between climate change and COVID-19. Most notable are (1) the potential for a reduction of the aerosol masking effect as industries slow, and (2) reappearance of many viruses as a result of melting ice (accelerated by climate change). Twenty-eight new virus groups were found recently in a melting glacier (https://www.popularmechanics.com/science/health/a30643717/viruses-found-melting-glacier/). The novel coronavirus currently in the news is the first of many such difficulties we face.

Erva Daninha: A survey by the science magazine called Advances in Atmospheric Sciences revealed that 2018 was the warmest year on record for ocean temperatures since monitoring began. Many people erroneously claim that forests are the “lungs of the earth”. Although important for oxygen production, carbon absorption and climate regulation, forests do not produce most of the world’s oxygen, the oceans do. What happens is that with global warming the temperatures in the oceans are increasing since more or less 93% of all the heat from climate change is absorbed by the oceans.

Biomes and marine fauna are extremely sensitive to climate change, and it is not only climate change that attacks the seas, but also pollution (including noise pollution from boats and submarines), industrial fishing, tourism, etc. The world’s oceans are in a very delicate situation, and unlike a terrestrial ecological reserve, where human destruction can be easily controlled and with great effort, reversed, what happens in the seas is that mitigation actions are out of control. Although possible, it is not easy to “plant” marine corals, planting grass is not the same as “planting algae”, although there are bizarre geoengineering experiments that propose this (which could be more disastrous than efficient). What diagnosis would you make out of the situation of the global oceans and what can happen if they continue to lose marine life?

Guy R. McPherson: We are products of the ocean. All life is dependent upon the ocean. Paul Watson, author and founder of the Sea Shepherd Conservation Society, says it best: “We cannot live on this planet with dead oceans. If our oceans die, we die.” We are in midst of the a global coral bleaching event, the third one in history. It is also the third one since 1998. Deoxygenation is a pressing problem in marine systems right now. I present abundant evidence from the peer-reviewed literature: https://guymcpherson.com/2018/12/ocean-deoxygenation-as-an-indicator-of-abrupt-climate-change/

Erva Daninha: Last year, an unreliable study by the Science magazine revealed that to limit the increase in global temperature to 1.5º C (Paris Agreement target) 1.2 trillion new trees would be needed worldwide, and the study advocated the indiscriminate planting of trees to absorb and reduce excess carbon dioxide in the earth’s atmosphere. We think that the study is unreliable because it presents only the quantity as a solution, without thinking about the complexity of the process and its side effects. The indiscriminate planting of trees, according to what we have read in the scientific literature and also to the opinions of scientists, such as that of the Brazilian Gerhard Overbeck, who refuted a proposal like this one from the Federal Institute of Technology in Zurich published in the article The global Tree Restoration Potential; can have environmental consequences. From our point of view, planting trees indiscriminately seems irresponsible and inconsequential. Nature is complex, self-regulating and interconnected, nature is not just quantity, but complexity. Biomes cannot be generated abruptly and in the long run the massive planting of trees could also bring environmental consequences such as depletion of underground water reserves, migrations or extinctions of species of animals and plants, etc. What do you think about this proposal of massive and indiscriminate planting of trees to reduce the amount of carbon dioxide in the Earth’s atmosphere?

Guy R. McPherson: This is a terrible idea. I wrote about it here: https://guymcpherson.com/2020/02/can-trees-sequester-enough-carbon/

Erva Daninha: Theodore Kaczynski, best known as the Unabomber, once wrote a text called “The Ship of Fools”. The text is metaphorical and very intelligent, it places the “ship” as our civilization, and the crew as the social figures that stand out the most in public complaints. In the story, the captain of the ship, who represents political leaders in the real world, is a very vain and confident person, as well as the crew, so they madly decide to travel in murky waters, towards dangerous icebergs. In the text, the captain, supported by his crew, leads the ship, which symbolizes civilization, towards increasingly dangerous waters, something that could easily result in the sinking of the boat if it crashed into icebergs. The dangerous waters in the text clearly symbolize the wrong course that our species is taking, and icebergs would be the end, the extinction. In the tale, while the captain steers the boat towards the icebergs, the crew begins to complain about various problems on the ship. There is the poor crew member who complains about earning little, there is the female crew member who complains about the inequality between women and men on the boat, there is the immigrant crew member who complains about the inequality in the treatment of foreigners, there is the crew member who is an Indian native who complains that the white stole their land and that is why he ended up on that ship and shouldn’t even be there, there is the gay crew member who complains that he is discriminated for his sexual preferences, there is the crew member who is vegan and who complains that the animals on the boat are being abused, there is the crew member who is a university professor and kind of an intellectual who defends and supports all previous complaints, and there is also another crew member, an individual who is being ignored by all the previous ones, and who says that while everybody complains about what bothers them, the ship is heading towards icebergs and that could kill all of them very soon. As the tale goes on, the complaints continue and the captain attends to each complaint little by little, granting more rights to stop the protests and calm the spirits. The same scenario is repeated a few times and the captain always manages to calm his crew down by granting them a little more rights, but without ever turning the boat’s course. At the end of the story everyone is more or less satisfied with their achievements, which are not big, but are significant anyways, and suddenly the boat crashes into a huge iceberg and everyone dies.

Dr. Guy, we believe that it does not take much effort to understand that this story perfectly reflects the critical situation in the world, with the serious ecological crisis underway, demagogue political leaders, social movements and their complaints, and that one percent who realizes about the delicate situation we are in and tries to alert about the ecocide or to act on their own way against the climate catastrophe. Do you believe that this tale lucidly reflects the reality of the world and the existing social movements?

Guy R. McPherson: Yes, without question. Kaczynski was well ahead of his time.

Erva Daninha: The respectable Brazilian scientist Antonio Donato Nobre published in 2014 a report called “The Climate Future of the Amazon” that points out that due to deforestation and degradation, the Amazon forest could be close to what he calls the “point of no return”, when it’s no longer able to regenerate on its own and begins to move towards total desertification. Since then, six years have passed and deforestation has intensified considerably, especially after the election of Jair Bolsonaro and the management of Ricardo Salles, Minister of the Environment. In other tropical forests of Asia and Africa the unfolding is the same, there is intense deforestation, according to some scientific reports. Tropical forests are extremely important in the world, they help to do things like regulating the climate and the rain cycle, so if these forests disappear the rains could also disappear and a myriad of ecosystems would be affected, perhaps extinguished. Dr. Guy, do you think there is a possibility that in the short term we will see a severe process of desertification in the world? This process is already happening in the world, including here in Brazil, especially in the northeast and northern regions of the country, but do you think that the world’s tropical forests can reach the “point of no return” and collapse at the point of becoming desertic, as Dr. Antonio Donato Nobre defends?

Guy R. McPherson: The ongoing exploitation of the Amazon is emblematic of our rush to greed. There are many examples of forests turned into deserts by “civilized” humans. The Amazonian example follows other previous examples in the Fertile Crescent, much of the Middle East and northern Africa, and so on. Given these examples, we can expect a similarly dire outcome in the Amazon.

Erva Daninha: Dr. Guy, a study by the Rights and Resources Initiative (RRI), Woods Hole Research Center (WHRC) and World Resources Institute (WRI) indicated that indigenous reserves hold 24% of the carbon stored on the terrestrial surface. The native peoples have different perspectives of existence and a different relation with the land, that is why they preserve it, they preserve it because they consider it to be sacred and because it is from it that they directly get their food, from hunting and gathering. Preservation is just a consequence, a beautiful and intelligent consequence.

We believe that there is a cultural crisis within civilization, especially with the arrival of the ultratechnological and cyber-connected modernity. Our diet, sleep patterns, cacophony, repetitive routine, types of work, the pressure from the family, work or society itself, over and under protection of the family, physical inactivity, obesity, cancer, epidemics and pandemics, “infocalypse”, social isolation on social networks, confinement, the artificialization of everything, vision pollution, the grayness of the cities, the speed at which everything goes (days, information, people, etc.), the climate changes that influence our disposition, social control, surveillance, pornography, advertisements, trends, traumas, abuses, drugs, ideologies, abstraction, loss of identity, loss of roots, liquidity of social, familiar and loving relationships, violence, police, prisons, wars, psychological illnesses, disorders, anxiety, depression, suicide, fear. We believe that a great part of all these problems comes from civilized life and its values, beliefs, routines and behaviors, especially modern life, and that these problems will only get worse over the years, and possibly even in the scenario of some socialistic, vegan, anarchistic or permacultural society. We don’t know if you have ever experienced this, but when we walk through a forest and feel its serenity, the smell of wet earth, the noise of the animals, everything seems to be fine, as if it were therapeutic. Perhaps it is ancient information contained in our DNA that brings back the memories of ancestral life in the forest. Some of us are direct descendants of native tribes and Quilombolas or have strong ties to what is left of these ancestral cultures and we feel that the solution to the global ecocide and the cultural crisis in civilization is not to think ahead, but to look back, to our past, to the ancestral way of life, at their respectful relations with the land, which is the reason why the indigenous people preserve their reserves and consequently they can absorb carbon. We are not naive, we do not romanticize tribal people and much less believe in a “primitive future” as the one preached by anarchists like John Zerzan and Kevin Tucker, nor do we think that it would be healthy for any ecosystem that a large part of the world’s population would change their lifestyle to a primitive model to “save the world”. With the number of humans that exist today on earth, we believe that no model would be sustainable in the long run. What we believe is that in another reality (currently existing) far from civilization and mass society, the wisdom and way of life of ancestral peoples really demonstrates the possibility of long-term coexistence with nature, where there is a future not only for the human species, but for all others. Of course, that is not what the future currently holds for the human species. But regardless of the end that is getting closer, what do you think about this idea of looking back, to ancestral times, and not further away to the future?

Guy R. McPherson: Absolutely. Many pre-civilized societies learned and practiced sustainability to a far greater extent than contemporary humans, as pointed out by Turnbull (The Forest People [1961], The Mountain People [1972]) and Quinn (Ishmael [1992], Beyond Civilization [1999]). A classic and often-cited example is the Iroquois Confederacy making decisions only after considering the impacts seven generations in the future. Padgett provided an education-based overview in 2018 (“Sustainability of Education: An Ecopedagogical Approach,” Journal of Sustainability Studies 1(1), Article 5, https://ir.una.edu/sustainabilityjournal/vol1/iss1/5). Clearly, learning was an important part of everyday living for the Iroquois Confederacy and other pre-civilized societies. In contrast, the evidence presented herein indicates that contemporary humans have not learned to practice sustainable actions.

Erva Daninha: You say stopping industrial civilization abruptly will bring the immediate demise for human life on earth, and maybe all life. But letting it go on, will have the same consequences, maybe twenty or thirty years into the future. So… What should we do? What do you propose? What’s your personal stance on this?

Guy R. McPherson: The certainty of death, coupled with the absurdity of life, helps me live with urgency and authenticity.

I am asked nearly every day for advice about living. I recommend living where you feel most alive. I recommend living fully. I recommend living with intention. I recommend living urgently, with death in mind. I recommend the pursuit of excellence. I recommend the pursuit of love. It’s small wonder I am often derided, mocked, rejected, and isolated by my contemporaries in the scientific community.

Pursue right action. Do not be attached to the outcome.

In light of the short time remaining in your life, and my own, I recommend all of the above, louder than before. More fully than you can imagine. To the limits of this restrictive culture, and beyond.

For you. For me. For us. For here. For now.

Live large. Be you, and bolder than you’ve ever been. Live as if you’re dying. The day draws near.

Erva Daninha: Dr. Guy, we appreciate the opportunity to interview you. It was a pleasure. If you want to leave a message feel free to do so.

Guy R. McPherson: Thank you. I appreciate the opportunity to inform people about the world we occupy.


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Erva Daninha: Antes de mais nada, queremos agradecer pelo senhor ter aceitado participar desta entrevista, Dr. Guy McPherson. As suas investigações científicas sobre o caos climático na civilização industrial são de enorme importância ao apontar a gravidade da crise ambiental no mundo provocada pela atividade humana.

Vamos lá. Você é conhecido por defender a ideia de Extinção Humana a Curto Prazo (NTHE). Você pode nos explicar o que é a NTHE e quais são os principais indicadores ecológicos que sustentam essa teoria?

Guy McPherson: Obrigado pela oportunidade de iniciar esta conversação com você e seu público.

A Extinção Humana a Curto Prazo (NTHE) *NdT1 como resultado das mudanças climáticas abruptas refere-se ao desaparecimento precoce da nossa espécie, o Homo Sapiens. Eu estive prognosticando a NTHE por vários anos, e outros começaram a compartilhar este prognóstico de forma recente.

Os humanos são animais e, como outros animais, nossa espécie requer um habitat para sobreviver. Especificamente, os seres humanos são mamíferos vertebrados. No entanto, o ritmo projetado das mudanças climáticas, usando o índice gradual de mudança prevista pelo Painel Intergovernamental sobre Mudanças Climáticas (IPCC) *NdT2, supera a capacidade dos vertebrados de se adaptar por um fator de 10.000. (https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/abs/10.1111/ele.12144). Os mamíferos levarão milhões de anos para se recuperar do evento de Extinção em Massa atualmente em processo (https://www.pnas.org/content/115/44/11262). Duvido seriamente que nossa espécie possa evitar a extinção, sobretudo quando os vertebrados não-humanos e os mamíferos não-humanos desapareçam.

Pelo menos sete espécies do gênero Homo já foram extintas, apesar de que nenhuma destas espécies se encontrava na Terra durante um evento de Extinção em Massa. Nós estamos no meio de um evento de extinção massiva. De acordo com o biólogo da conservação Gerardo Ceballos, principal autor de um artigo publicado em 19 de junho de 2015 na revista Advanced Science, indicando que a Terra está experimentando um evento de Extinção em Massa (https://advances.sciencemag.org/content/1/5/e1400253), “a vida levará muitos milhões de anos para se recuperar, e nossa própria espécie poderia desaparecer antes que isso aconteça”. (https://phys.org/news/2015-06-sixth-mass-extinction-declares.html). Um artigo com o mesmo autor publicado em 25 de Julho de 2017 na Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences indica que a Terra está em um processo de Extinção em Massa bastante avançado (https://www.pnas.org/content/114/30/E6089.short).

Um artigo na publicação de Novembro de 2018 da revista Scientific Reports indica que uma elevação média de 5-6 graus na temperatura global levaria à extinção toda a vida na terra (https://www.nature.com/articles/s41598-018-35068-1). Esse aumento da temperatura média global é esperado logo após os oceanos do Ártico ficarem sem gelo, um evento incorretamente projetado para o ano 2016 + 3 na publicação de 2012 da Annual Reviews sobre A Terra e as Ciências Planetárias (https://www.annualreviews.org/doi/abs/10.1146/annurev-earth-042711-105345). Apesar desta projeção incorreta, um Ártico sem gelo aparece no horizonte próximo.

As viagens comerciais aéreas representam uma ameaça existencial para toda a vida na Terra. De acordo com um artigo publicado na revista Atmospheric Chemistry and Physics de 27 de Junho de 2019, apenas os rastros dos aviões poderiam eliminar o habitat da maioria, senão de todas as formas de vida sobre a terra, ao interromper os padrões da circulação atmosférica (https://www.atmos-chem-phys.net/19/8163/2019/). Esta conclusão é apoiada por um estudo publicado on-line em 12 de Dezembro de 2019 na Earth and Space Science Open Archive (https://www.essoar.org/doi/10.1002/essoar.10501296.1).

A resposta padrão à atual crise climática é recomendar a redução das emissões de gases do efeito estufa. No entanto, a atividade industrial reduzida se traduz em uma redução abrupta dos aerossóis atmosféricos. Estes aerossóis refletem a radiação solar recebida, mantendo a Terra mais fria do que seria sem esses gases. Investigações sobre o efeito de resfriamento destes aerossóis apareceram na literatura científica sob revisão por pares desde 1929 (Angstor, 1929, “Sobre a transmissão atmosférica da radiação solar e sobre a poeira no ar”, Geografiska Annaler, 11, 156–166). A redução de apenas 20% da atividade industrial levaria a um aumento de 1 grau na temperatura global média em questão de semanas (Rosenfeld et al 2019, https://science.sciencemag.org/content/363/6427/eaav0566, e https://www.sustainability-times.com/environmental-protection/research-cooling-from-atmospheric-particles-may-mask-greater-warming/).

Erva Daninha: A conhecida ativista e escritora Naomi Klein, ao contrário de muitos negacionistas climáticos, argumenta que a atividade humana está intimamente relacionada à crise climática; no entanto, ela concentra a maior parte de seus esforços na pintura do capitalismo como o grande vilão do meio ambiente. Ocasionalmente, Naomi também critica o “socialismo industrial” de algumas nações, mas na maioria das vezes ela defende a mesma tese repetida pela grande maioria dos esquerdistas e ecologistas de todo o mundo: “se eliminarmos o capitalismo, tudo ficará bem”. Dr. Guy, acreditamos que suas críticas são mais amplas, elas visam o complexo industrial global e não apenas um tipo específico de ordem social. Por que você acha que a sociedade tecnológico-industrial global é o problema real e não apenas o capitalismo?

Guy McPherson: Como Tim Garrett apontou com base em extensas pesquisas, a civilização é uma máquina de calor (https://faculty.utah.edu/u0294462-TIM_GARRETT/research/index.hml). Em outras palavras, esse agrupamento de estruturas e seres vivos produz calor. Pouco importa como a civilização industrial opera. Os painéis solares e turbinas eólicas aquecem o planeta de igual maneira como a queima de combustíveis fósseis. A civilização está nos levando a um clima ao estilo do Plioceno que poderia chegar em 2030 (de acordo com um artigo da Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences publicado em 26 de Dezembro de 2018, que se apoia no fortemente conservador Representative Concentration Pathways do IPCC, https://www.pnas.org/content/115/52/13288.short). Não consigo imaginar que humanos e outros mamíferos vertebrados sejam capazes de sobreviver a uma taxa tão alta de mudanças. Ainda sim, como apontei acima, desacelerar ou deter a civilização aqueceria o planeta ainda mais rápido do que se a mantivéssemos em pé.

Erva Daninha: Entre muitos outros cenários, temos destacadas as visões utópicas e esperançosas defendidas por Naomi Klein em relação ao ecossocialismo como uma alternativa para “salvar o mundo” de uma catástrofe ecológica e temos também a delirante “revolução primitivista” contra a civilização industrial apoiada por anarquistas como Kevin Tucker e John Zerzan. Em sua opinião, quão eficientes esses sistemas seriam quando o censo global prevê quase 10 bilhões de pessoas no planeta para 2050? Vivemos em um planeta finito com recursos limitados e a maioria desses recursos já desapareceram; mesmo uma mudança radical em direção a um sistema supostamente sustentável exigiria outras fontes massivas de energia, especialmente vinculadas a atividades de transporte ou para a produção de alimentos e, mesmo em casos mais extremos, como os da “utopia primitiva” defendida por alguns anarquistas, atividades em massa como alimentação e moradia, ou o que quer que seja, teriam um enorme impacto ambiental.

A natureza tende a exercer um controle auto-regulador sobre as espécies da Terra para impor uma coexistência orgânica, algo que alguns chamam de cascata trófica, mas a nossa espécie escapou disso e usou a tecnologia moderna a seu favor para superar o controle populacional imposto pela natureza manipulando o meio ambiente e expandindo-se para além de seus limites, enquanto consome a natureza indiscriminadamente e destrói grande parte dos recursos limitados da Terra, unicamente a benefício próprio. Você não acredita que exista uma superpopulação no mundo e que nossa cultura moderna seja alienada e decadente e que, dada a quantidade de bilhões de pessoas no mundo, qualquer proposta para criar uma sociedade global sustentável seria falha?

Guy McPherson: Como indiquei acima, duvido seriamente que sobreviveremos até 2030, muito menos até 2050. Uma população excessiva de humanos está consumindo excessivamente materiais finitos por um tempo excessivo. Superamos severamente o número sustentável de população humana sobre a terra.

Erva Daninha: Você afirmou em várias ocasiões que o IPCC é bastante conservador em suas estimativas. O senhor acredita que exista algum tipo pacto de conduta nessas entidades ou na própria comunidade científica que estabeleça um padrão de comportamento para evitar alarmes com impacto na economia ou na própria sociedade? Por exemplo, aqui no Brasil, o Instituto Nacional de Pesquisas Espaciais (INPE) divulgou dados alarmantes corroborados pela NASA sobre o aumento drástico do desmatamento na floresta amazônica no ano de 2019, e esta ação resultou na demissão de Ricardo Galvão, diretor da agência, a pedido do presidente Jair Bolsonaro. Acreditamos que, embora alertem sobre a crise climática, estas entidades e a maioria dos cientistas operam dentro da mesma lógica que a da cultura da civilização industrial-tecnológica e defendem a manutenção dessa lógica que, em teoria, seria a essência do caos climático, então, talvez por ordem dos governos (como foi o caso no Brasil), ou por iniciativa própria, as instituições manejam seus dados com precaução para não expor a inviabilidade dessa ordem social ecocida. O que você pensa sobre isso?

Guy McPherson: O IPCC usa uma abordagem muito conservadora para desenvolver as suas avaliações. Os cientistas dentro dos grupos de trabalho geralmente recorrem à relutância ao tirar suas conclusões. Depois que uma avaliação é preparada por cientistas conservadores, exigidos pelo IPCC para obter consenso, essa avaliação é enviada aos governos para uma revisão. Como você pode imaginar, os governos do mundo estão interessados principalmente em sustentar o crescimento econômico. “Salvar o mundo” não está na sua agenda.

Erva Daninha: Recentemente, um cientista brasileiro revelou que a Antártica atingiu uma temperatura surpreendente de 20º C, algo que “nunca foi visto antes”. Tais temperaturas são drásticos exemplos do aquecimento global. As consequências do aumento da temperatura nesses ambientes congelados já são bem conhecidas, o aumento do nível do mar é amplamente discutido na comunidade científica, mas os efeitos do derretimento não se restringem a apenas isso. A revista Nature já publicou um estudo no qual afirma que a Antártica está possivelmente retendo quantidades colossais de gás metano produzido ao longo de milhares de anos dentro de sua camada de gelo e que, se esse gás fosse liberado, teria um impacto agressivo no efeito estufa. O mesmo vale para o Ártico com permafrost, onde a situação é talvez ainda mais grave, pois o solo do Ártico não está mais congelado. Estudos indicam que o permafrost contém o dobro da quantidade total de carbono atualmente na atmosfera da Terra, e que um vazamento massivo desse material seria catastrófico para a vida na Terra, podendo até causar uma extinção em massa como a do período Permiano-Triássico. Você acredita que o efeito da “arma de clatratos” poderia realmente colocar em risco a maior parte da vida na Terra até 2040?

Guy McPherson: Não só eu concordo, como também o renomado cientista climático James Hansen que discutiu esta possibilidade. Um artigo de 2017 revisado entre pares por Hansen e seus colegas, indicava que a Terra se encontrava em suas temperaturas mais altas desde a existência da nossa espécie (https://arxiv.org/abs/1609.05878). De fato, as emissões de metano provenientes do fundo do gelo e também as emissões de metano que saem do derretimento do permafrost representam dois dos sete meios pelos quais o planeta poderia aquecer muito rapidamente, destruindo o habitat para os seres humanos (https://weeklyhubris.com/seven-distinct-paths-to-loss-of-habitat-for-humans/).

Erva Daninha: Em 2014, em uma entrevista à Russia Today, citando um estudo do cientista climático Tim Garrett, você disse que apenas o colapso total da civilização industrial poderia impedir mudanças climáticas descontroladas. Por razões lógicas, uma solução baseada nessa premissa nunca virá de nenhum governo ou instituição como a ONU. Pelo contrário, o fraco Acordo de Paris já foi abandonado pelos Estados Unidos, o maior emissor de gases de efeito estufa de toda a história, e o Estado brasileiro também mostrou sinais de sua intenção de abandonar o acordo. Estudos como o da Universal Ecological Fundation já apontaram que o acordo não será suficiente para limitar o aumento da temperatura entre 1,5º C e 2º C em relação aos níveis da era pré-industrial. Avaliações como a sua indicam a possibilidade de um aumento superior a 3,5º C em um curto período de tempo. A interrupção das atividades industriais é impensável no mundo moderno, pois isso significaria negar a própria lógica na qual a maioria dos países estão inseridos. No entanto, isso não significa que cenários como esse sejam impossíveis de serem alcançados, apenas não através da ação de governos, claro.

No final do ano passado, os rebeldes houthis atacaram a maior refinaria de petróleo do mundo na Arábia Saudita com drones, interrompendo metade da produção do reino, que fornece 10% de todo o petróleo consumido no mundo. Embora extremo, este é um exemplo real da interrupção abrupta de uma atividade que é prejudicial ao meio ambiente. Grupos como os Vingadores do Delta do Níger também causaram danos catastróficos à produção de petróleo em países como a Nigéria. Estudos publicados pela revista Science Advances também concluíram que a guerra no Oriente Médio fez com que a poluição diminuísse em algumas áreas da região, porque os níveis de atividade industrial diminuíram e as atividades da vida urbana, como dirigir, foram afetadas. Deixando de lado todo o julgamento que poderia implicar esse tipo de ação e considerando o fato de que são necessárias ações urgentes para interromper a atividade industrial e os governos nunca as oferecerão, você considera que há eficiência prática nesse tipo de ação para interromper as emissões de poluentes ou destruição do meio ambiente no mundo? Repito, pergunto de uma perspectiva puramente prática, deixando de lado o julgamento sobre se é legal ou ilegal.

Guy McPherson: Consulte as informações anteriores sobre o efeito do Escurecimento Global.

Erva Daninha: Dr. Guy, o mundo está atualmente enfrentando uma pandemia do COVID-19, uma das mais catastróficas dos últimos tempos. A atenção está praticamente toda focada nos danos econômicos causados por essa situação, fala-se muito de uma nova recessão econômica no mundo e de uma crise financeira global semelhante à de 2008, mas pouco se fala sobre os benefícios dessa pandemia para o meio ambiente. Você mesmo disse que a interrupção total das atividades industriais são os eventos mais benéficos que podem contribuir para o não aumento da temperatura global e é exatamente isso que esta doença está causando.

Na China, houve uma grande paralisia das atividades econômicas e a redução de gases poluentes foi enorme e abrupta. Em fevereiro deste ano, a concentração desses gases foi 25% menor em relação ao mesmo período do ano passado, segundo o Center for Research on Energy and Clean Air. Na Itália, com o turismo reduzido a zero, as águas do Grande Canal de Veneza pareciam melhores e a qualidade do ar melhorava na área, segundo a prefeitura. Dados do satélite Sentinel-5P do programa Copernican da Comissão Europeia em parceria com a Agência Espacial Europeia (ESA) mostraram que, em termos gerais, a poluição teve uma forte queda na Itália, especialmente na região norte do país, que foi a mais afetada pelo vírus. Certamente, o mesmo se repete em várias regiões do planeta, e não apenas porque as atividades industriais foram paralisadas ou reduzidas, mas também porque o turismo, o transporte e muitas outras atividades diárias da civilização tecnológico-industrial cessaram.

Com base nisso, como você vê esses grandes desastres e seus benefícios ambientais? Acreditamos que eles contribuem para conter a crise climática global e indicam que, para o planeta, nosso estilo de vida civilizado é tão ruim quanto uma pandemia é para nós. Também pensamos que os desastres podem funcionar como uma catarse auto-reguladora da terra, tentando desmantelar o estilo de vida moderno e prejudicial e a grande civilização tecno-industrial.

Guy McPherson: Na verdade, revi minha avaliação sobre os horrores da civilização industrial, conforme observado acima. A civilização industrial intoxica o ar, suja as águas e enche os mares de óleo. A civilização industrial é uma praga para o planeta vivo. No entanto, partindo da perspectiva das mudanças climáticas, manter a civilização ajuda a sustentar o habitat dos seres humanos na Terra. Na nossa ausência, as plantas nucleares do mundo entrariam em colapso catastroficamente, deixando assim o planeta banhado em radiação ionizante. Suspeito que um evento destas características destruiria o habitat para todas as formas de vida na Terra em poucas gerações depois que as mutações letais começassem.

Erva Daninha: Atualmente vemos o surgimento de um “Green New Deal” global através de novos movimentos como o Extinction Rebellion e o Movimento Sunrise e também por ativistas climáticos como Greta Thunberg. Para os pouco informados, parece algo novo, mas o mesmo aconteceu em tempos passados com várias ONGs, com ênfase no Greenpeace, que ao longo dos anos reduziu suas atividades a performances pacíficas a serem registradas e disseminadas nas mídias sociais, campanhas para assinar petições para o governo e uma intensa atividade de greenwashing para promover o consumo supostamente sustentável.

Hoje as grandes eco-organizações do passado estão promovendo um discurso de mudança individual para mudar o mundo, o famoso ativismo “faça a sua parte”, uma vez que foram aceitas e incorporadas na própria lógica do sistema que criticaram, como é o caso o caso do Greenpeace, que fez pactos com empresas de exploração petroleira e da área madeireira e pesqueira, além de algumas outras. O Extinction Rebellion tem uma aparência muito jovem e atraente, o movimento atrai muitas pessoas para gritar contra líderes globais e exigir mudanças nas políticas ambientais em todo o mundo, respeitando os limites que a ordem lhes impõe e, indiretamente, usando a mesma lógica à qual se opõem e esperando dos líderes globais as tão esperadas mudanças nas políticas ambientais, os mesmos líderes que demonstram que são incapazes de cumprir acordos básicos como o de Paris. Você não acha que há ingenuidade nesses movimentos e que, em vez de abordar a raiz do problema, eles indiretamente defendem reformas e perpetuam a civilização industrial destrutiva? Se eles não estão lutando pelo fim da sociedade industrial, mas pela existência de uma “sociedade industrial melhor”, essa luta não seria um grande problema e um mero greenwashing?

Guy McPherson: Estes movimentos são excepcionalmente ingênuos. Como indiquei acima, a civilização industrial é uma máquina de calor, mas diminuir ou parar a civilização industrial aqueceria o planeta muito rapidamente. Isso representa um clássico Ardil 22 *NdT3.

Erva Daninha: Um relatório da ONU divulgado no ano passado, provavelmente conservador em termos numéricos, disse que um milhão de espécies de animais e plantas estão em risco de extinção. A principal causa indicada pelo relatório é a agricultura industrial, a poluição e o aquecimento dos oceanos. Muitos cientistas apontam para o mesmo. Você também acredita que estamos atualmente enfrentando a sexta extinção em massa? Esta seria a primeira extinção em massa causada pela espécie humana, certo? Antropoceno seria um termo adequado?

Guy McPherson: A terra se encontra no meio da Sétima Extinção em Massa. Passamos muito tempo acreditando que estávamos na Sexta Extinção em Massa, mas um artigo publicado na revista Historical Biology em 5 de Setembro de 2019 indica um evento de Extinção em Massa anteriormente desconhecido (https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1080/08912963.2019.1658096). Deixando esse pequeno ponto de lado, a atual evento de Extinção em Massa é comumente denominado Extinção em Massa do Antropoceno, porque é resultado das atividades humanas (principalmente, da civilização industrial).

Erva Daninha: O estudo de Mark Boyce publicado no Journal of Mammalogy sobre a experiência de reintroduzir lobos no Parque Nacional de Yellowstone reforçou o que muitos já sabiam, a natureza é interconectada e interdependente com as espécies que vivem nela, sejam animais, plantas, fungos, o que quer que seja. Se um único animal desaparece para sempre, toda a cascata trófica é desestabilizada e as consequências podem ser incomensuráveis.

Atualmente, todos os biomas terrestres estão ameaçados pelo avanço da civilização e a velocidade com que as espécies são extintas é mil vezes superior ao normal, segundo um estudo da University College London. Essa extinção massiva põe em perigo a vida não apenas das espécies, mas também dos próprios biomas. O bioma marinho, talvez o mais importante para a vida na Terra, está desaparecendo rapidamente. Os insetos vitais para os ciclos terrestres, como os polinizadores, também morrem em quantidades catastróficas. Você acha que essa enorme onda de extinção pode atingir a própria espécie humana em algum momento?

Guy McPherson: Várias outras espécies do gênero Homo foram extintas. De fato, todos os indivíduos morrem e todas as espécies se extinguem. O artigo revisado por pares de 13 de Novembro de 2018 na Scientific Reports indica que toda a vida na Terra se extinguirá com os aumentos de temperatura prognosticados para o futuro próximo, principalmente como resultado de co-extinções (https://www.nature.com/articles/s41598-018-35068-1). Em outras palavras, espécies como a nossa, que dependem de outras espécies para sua própria existência, enfrentam um risco existencial especificamente porque dependem de outras espécies. O atual apocalipse de insetos, o ritmo acelerado das mudanças climáticas, etc. A união interdependente de tantas formas de vida na Terra garante a nossa extinção a curto prazo.

Erva Daninha: Às vezes você é apontado na comunidade científica e em círculos ecologistas como alguém tremendamente pessimista e sem esperança. Nós pensamos em você como alguém que é apenas realista e bem informado. Na verdade é a própria realidade pessimista e cheia de más notícias para o futuro da humanidade. No ano passado, um texto chamado A esperança é um erro e uma mentira foi publicado em seu site, no qual você destrói o comportamento esperançoso sobre o futuro de nossa espécie. Dr. Guy, você não acha que há uma dificuldade amarga na comunidade científica, e entre militantes e ativistas, normalmente anarquistas e esquerdistas, de aceitar a realidade sobre o nosso futuro e entender o fato de que dias melhores nunca virão?

Nós em particular, somos bastante realistas (e também pessimistas) sobre o futuro de nossa espécie e acreditamos que, como seres humanos, traçamos nosso próprio fim e que colheremos as consequências da estrutura ecocida que os homo sapiens ergueram. Isso nos permite lidar com a realidade da maneira mais dura, fria e necessária. Ativistas ingênuos gritam para seus líderes políticos adotarem novas políticas ambientais, anarquistas e esquerdistas já parecem saber que não há saídas, mas eles preferem negar isso com todas suas forças e se apegam a sonhos utópicos confortáveis que não podem ser alcançados. A esperança é como uma droga e este perfil de pessoas é viciado, não podem aceitar os dias sombrios que estão por vir, então correm em círculos, porque renunciar à esperança seria renunciar à própria humanidade e a tudo o que ela criou até hoje. O que você pensa sobre isso?

Guy McPherson: A sociedade adotou a ideia de que a esperança é universalmente boa. Eu acreditei nisso por um longo tempo, então busquei a definição no dicionário. Como você indicou, prefiro a realidade dura a submergir-me em delírios que dificilmente serão alcançados, e a esperança é uma versão destes pensamentos inalcançáveis.

Erva Daninha: Dr. Guy, o que você acha da perspectiva antropocêntrica de se enxergar as coisas? Esse tipo de pensamento que coloca o ser humano no centro de tudo e lhe dá mais importância do que as outras espécies está presente mesmo nas escolas contemporâneas de pensamento que apresentam uma crítica ecológica radical, como é o caso do eco-anarquismo.

Acreditamos que o ser humano é apenas mais uma espécie dentre as milhares que existem, e que talvez nem seja tão importante. O ciclo vida-morte está omnipresente na natureza e faz parte da trajetória de qualquer ser vivo; os seres nascem e morrem o tempo todo. O ser humano moderno nega a morte e sempre busca prolongar a sua existência. Não é errado dizer que a evolução da medicina, especialmente a medicina moderna, que proporcionou aos humanos tanta longevidade, fez com que burlassem a seleção natural e se expandissem em um ritmo muito acelerado. Hoje, as técnicas de biotecnologia e nanotecnologia flertam com a imortalidade. Acreditamos que esse tipo de pensamento também influenciou a capacidade da humanidade de alcançar um maior grau de ecocídio na Terra e é a base dos valores que apoiam as civilizações. O que você pensa sobre isso?

Guy McPherson: Estou completamente de acordo. O Homo Sapiens representa uma espécie entre milhões que ocupam a Terra. Criamos as condições ambientais contrárias à continuação da vida neste maravilhoso planeta. Nós nos esforçamos para alcançar a imortalidade a nível individual e a nível de espécie. Pelo contrário, a aceitação da própria morte é um presente cheio de paz. O mesmo sentimento mantém sua veracidade ao nível da espécie.

Erva Daninha: Dr. Guy, existe a possibilidade de que o aquecimento global possa revelar ao mundo algo tão sério quanto a atual pandemia de coronavírus? Notícias recentes mostraram que o derretimento no Ártico e em outras regiões congeladas estava resultando no reaparecimento de bactérias e vírus considerados extintos e também tinha a possibilidade de liberar bactérias e vírus pré-históricos de capacidade patogênica desconhecida. A revista Scientific Reports já publicou que o derretimento do gelo no Ártico liberou um vírus normalmente encontrado no Atlântico que contaminou lontras marinhas no Alasca. Acreditamos que os super-microrganismos patogênicos poderiam, através do derretimento nos polos extremos da terra, alcançar as costas de vários países e iniciar infecções por pandemia, como ocorreu com o coronavírus na China, que poderia ter começado em um mercado de frutos do mar. Com base na sua experiência como pesquisador, você acredita que essa possibilidade é real?

Guy McPherson: Há poucas dúvidas sobre as interações entre as mudanças climáticas e o COVID-19. As mais importantes são (1) a potencial redução do efeito do Escurecimento Global à medida que as indústrias desaceleram, e (2) o reaparecimento de muitos vírus como resultado do derretimento do gelo (acelerado pelas mudanças climáticas). 28 novos grupos virais foram encontrados recentemente em uma geleira que estava derretendo (https://www.popularmechanics.com/science/health/a30643717/viruses-found-melting-glacier/). O novo coronavírus atualmente nos noticiários é a primeira de muitas dessas dificuldades que vamos enfrentar.

Erva Daninha: Uma pesquisa da revista Science Advances in Atmospheric Sciences revelou que 2018 foi o ano mais quente já registrado para as temperaturas dos oceanos desde o início do monitoramento. Muitas pessoas afirmam erroneamente que as florestas são os “pulmões da terra”. Embora importantes para a produção de oxigênio, absorção de carbono e regulação do clima, as florestas não produzem a maior parte do oxigênio do mundo, os oceanos produzem. O que acontece é que, com o aquecimento global, as temperaturas nos oceanos estão aumentando, uma vez que mais ou menos 93% de todo o calor das mudanças climáticas é absorvido pelos oceanos.

Os biomas e a fauna marinha são extremamente sensíveis às mudanças climáticas, e não são apenas as mudanças climáticas que atacam os mares, mas também a poluição (incluindo a poluição sonora de barcos e submarinos), a pesca industrial, o turismo etc. Os oceanos do mundo estão em uma situação muito delicada e, ao contrário de uma reserva ecológica terrestre, onde a destruição humana pode ser facilmente controlada e com grande esforço, revertida, o que acontece nos mares é que as ações de mitigação estão fora de controle. Embora possível, não é fácil “plantar” corais marinhos, plantar grama não é o mesmo que “plantar algas”, embora existam experiências bizarras de geoengenharia que proponham isso (o que poderia ser mais desastroso do que eficiente). Que diagnóstico você faria da situação dos oceanos globais e o que pode acontecer se eles continuarem a perder a vida marinha?

Guy McPherson: Nós somos produtos do oceano. Todas as formas de vida dependem do oceano. Paul Watson, autor e fundador da Sea Shepherd Conservation Society, afirma da melhor forma: “Não podemos viver neste planeta com os oceanos mortos. Se os oceanos morrem, nós morreremos”. Estamos no meio de um evento global de “branqueamento de corais”, o terceiro na história. Também é o terceiro desde 1998. A desoxigenação é um problema urgente para os sistemas marinhos atualmente. Eu apresentei evidências abundantes na literatura revisada por pares: https://guymcpherson.com/2018/12/ocean-deoxygenation-as-an-indicator-of-abrupt-climate-change/

Erva Daninha: No ano passado, um estudo pouco confiável da revista Science afirmou que para limitar o aumento da temperatura global a 1,5º C (meta do Acordo de Paris) seriam necessários 1,2 trilhão de novas árvores em todo o mundo, e o estudo defendeu o plantio indiscriminado de árvores para absorver e reduzir o excesso de dióxido de carbono na atmosfera da Terra. Achamos que o estudo não é confiável, pois apresenta apenas a quantidade como solução, sem pensar na complexidade do processo e em seus efeitos colaterais. O plantio indiscriminado de árvores, de acordo com o que lemos na literatura científica, como a análise do brasileiro Gerhard Overbeck, que confrontou uma proposta como essa do Instituto Federal de Tecnologia de Zurique publicada no artigo The global tree restoration potential (O potencial global de restauração de árvores); pode ter consequências ambientais. Do nosso ponto de vista, plantar árvores indiscriminadamente parece irresponsável e inconsequente. A natureza é complexa, auto-reguladora e interconectada, a natureza não é apenas quantidade, mas complexidade. Os biomas não podem ser gerados abruptamente e, a longo prazo, o plantio massivo de árvores também pode trazer consequências ambientais, como o esgotamento das reservas de água subterrâneas, migrações ou extinções de espécies de animais e plantas, etc. O que você acha dessa proposta de cultivo massivo e plantio indiscriminado de árvores para reduzir a quantidade de dióxido de carbono na atmosfera da Terra?

Guy McPherson: Esta ideia é terrível. Escrevi a respeito aqui: https://guymcpherson.com/2020/02/can-trees-sequester-enough-carbon/

Erva Daninha: Theodore Kaczynski, mais conhecido como Unabomber, escreveu uma vez um texto chamado “O Navio dos Tolos”. O texto é metafórico e muito inteligente, coloca o “navio” como nossa civilização e a tripulação como figuras sociais que mais se destacam em reclamações públicas. Na história, o capitão do navio, que representa líderes políticos no mundo real, é uma pessoa muito vaidosa e confiante, assim como a tripulação, então eles decidem loucamente viajar em águas turvas, em direção a perigosos icebergs. No texto, o capitão, apoiado por sua tripulação, lidera o navio, que simboliza a civilização, em direção a águas cada vez mais perigosas, algo que poderia facilmente resultar no naufrágio do barco se ele colidisse com icebergs. As águas perigosas no texto simbolizam claramente o rumo errado que nossa espécie está tomando, e os icebergs seriam o fim, a extinção. No conto, enquanto o capitão dirige o barco em direção aos icebergs, a tripulação começa a reclamar de vários problemas no navio. Há o membro da tripulação pobre que reclama de ganhar pouco, há a membra da tripulação feminina que reclama da desigualdade entre homens e mulheres no barco, há o membro da tripulação imigrante que reclama da desigualdade no tratamento de estrangeiros, há o membro da tripulação que é um índio que reclama que os brancos roubaram suas terras e é por isso que ele acabou naquele navio e nem deveria estar ali, há o membro da tripulação gay que reclama que ele é discriminado por suas preferências sexuais, há o membro da tripulação que é vegano e queixa-se de que os animais no barco estão sendo maltratados, há o membro da tripulação que é professor universitário e um tipo de intelectual que defende e apoia todas as queixas anteriores, e há também outro tripulante, um indivíduo que é ignorado por todos os anteriores e que diz que, embora todos se queixem do que os incomoda, o navio está indo em direção a icebergs e isso poderia matar a todos eles muito em breve. À medida que a história continua, as queixas continuam e o capitão atende a cada uma delas pouco a pouco, concedendo mais direitos para interromper os protestos e acalmar os ânimos. O mesmo cenário é repetido algumas vezes e o capitão sempre consegue acalmar a sua tripulação, concedendo-lhes um pouco mais de direitos, mas sem nunca mudar o rumo do barco. No final da história, todos estão mais ou menos satisfeitos com suas realizações, que não são grandes, mas são importantes de qualquer maneira, e de repente o barco colide com um imenso iceberg e todos morrem.

Dr. Guy, acreditamos que não é preciso muito esforço para entender que essa história reflete perfeitamente a situação crítica do mundo, com a grave crise ecológica em andamento, líderes políticos demagogos, movimentos sociais e suas queixas, e aquele 1% que percebe a delicada situação em que estamos e tenta alertar sobre o ecocídio ou agir à sua maneira contra a catástrofe climática. Você acredita que esse conto reflete lucidamente a realidade do mundo e os movimentos sociais existentes?

Guy McPherson: Sim, sem sombra de dúvidas. Kaczynski esteve a frente de seu tempo.

Erva Daninha: O respeitável cientista brasileiro Antonio Donato Nobre publicou em 2014 um relatório chamado O Futuro Climático da Amazônia, que destaca que, devido ao desmatamento e degradação, a floresta amazônica pode estar próxima do que ele chama de “ponto sem retorno”, quando não é mais capaz de se regenerar por conta própria e começa a se mover em direção à desertificação total. Desde então, seis anos se passaram e o desmatamento se intensificou consideravelmente, principalmente após a eleição de Jair Bolsonaro e a gestão de Ricardo Salles, Ministro do Meio Ambiente. Em outras florestas tropicais da Ásia e da África, o desdobramento é o mesmo, há intenso desmatamento, de acordo com alguns relatórios científicos. As florestas tropicais são extremamente importantes no mundo, pois ajudam a regular o clima e o ciclo das chuvas; portanto, se essas florestas desaparecerem, as chuvas também poderão desaparecer e uma infinidade de ecossistemas seriam afetados e, talvez até extintos. Dr. Guy, você acha que existe a possibilidade de que, a curto prazo, possamos ver um processo severo de desertificação no planeta? Esse fenômeno já está ocorrendo no mundo, inclusive aqui no Brasil, especialmente nas regiões nordeste e norte do país, mas você acha que as florestas tropicais do mundo podem atingir o “ponto de não retorno” e colapsar e tornarem-se desertos, como defende o Dr. Antonio Donato Nobre?

Guy McPherson: A atual exploração da Amazônia é um emblema de nossa corrida à ganância. Existem muitos exemplos de florestas transformadas em desertos pelos humanos “civilizados”. O exemplo da Amazônia é uma continuação de outros exemplos anteriores no Crescente Fértil, grande parte do Oriente Médio e o Norte da África, e assim por diante. Em vista destes exemplos, podemos esperar um resultado terrível para a Amazônia.

Erva Daninha: Dr. Guy, um estudo da Rights and Resources Initiative (RRI), Woods Hole Research Center (WHRC) e World Resources Institute (WRI) indicou que as reservas indígenas detêm 24% do carbono armazenado na superfície terrestre. Os povos nativos têm perspectivas de existência distintas da nossa e uma relação diferente com a terra, por isso a preservam, a preservam porque a consideram sagrada e porque é dela que obtêm sua comida diretamente, da caça, coleta e baixa agricultura. A preservação é apenas uma consequência, uma consequência bonita e inteligente.

Acreditamos que há uma crise cultural dentro da civilização, especialmente com a chegada da modernidade ultratecnológica e cibernética. Nossa dieta, padrões de sono, cacofonia, rotina repetitiva, tipos de trabalho, pressão da família, trabalho ou sociedade, super e subproteção familiar, sedentarismo, obesidade, câncer, epidemias e pandemias, “infocalipse”, isolamento social nas redes sociais, confinamento, artificialização de tudo, poluição visual, o acinzentado das cidades, velocidade com o que tudo passa (dias, informações, pessoas, etc.), mudanças climáticas que influenciam em nossa disposição, controle social, vigilância, pornografia, publicidade, tendências, traumas, abusos, drogas, ideologias, abstração, perda de identidade, perda de raízes, liquidez de relacionamentos sociais, familiares e amorosos, violência, polícia, prisões, guerras, doenças psicológicas, distúrbios, ansiedade, depressão, suicídio, medo. Acreditamos que boa parte de todos esses problemas advém da vida civilizada e de seus valores, crenças, rotinas e comportamentos, principalmente da vida moderna, e que esses problemas só pioram com o passar dos anos e, possivelmente, alguns deles podem reincidir mesmo no cenário de alguma sociedade socialista, vegana, anarquista ou permacultural. Não sabemos se você já reparou nisso, mas quando caminhamos por uma floresta e sentimos a sua serenidade, o cheiro de terra molhada, o barulho dos animais, tudo parece estar bem, como se fosse terapêutico. Talvez seja a informação antiga contida em nosso DNA que traz de volta as memórias da vida ancestral na floresta. Alguns de nós somos descendentes diretos de tribos nativas e quilombolas ou temos fortes laços com o que resta dessas culturas ancestrais e sentimos que a solução para o ecocídio global e a crise cultural na civilização não é pensar no futuro, mas olhar para trás, ao nosso passado, ao modo de vida ancestral, em suas respeitosas relações com a terra, razão pela qual os povos indígenas preservam suas reservas e, consequentemente, elas podem absorver o carbono. Não somos ingênuos, não romantizamos povos tribais e muito menos cremos em um “futuro primitivo” como aquele pregado por anarquistas como John Zerzan e Kevin Tucker, nem achamos que seria saudável para qualquer ecossistema que uma grande parte da população mundial mudasse seu estilo de vida para um modelo primitivo para “salvar o mundo”. Com o número de humanos que existem hoje na Terra, acreditamos que nenhum modelo seria sustentável a longo prazo. O que acreditamos é que, em outra realidade (atualmente existente) longe da civilização e da sociedade de massas, a sabedoria e o modo de vida dos povos ancestrais realmente demonstram a possibilidade de coexistência a longo prazo com a natureza, onde há um futuro não apenas para o ser humano, mas para todas as outras espécies. Certamente, não é isso que o atualmente o futuro reserva para a espécie humana. Mas, independentemente do fim que está se aproximando, o que você acha dessa ideia de olhar para trás, para os tempos ancestrais e não para o futuro?

Guy McPherson: Coincido absolutamente. Muitas sociedades pré-civilizadas aprenderam e praticaram a sustentabilidade muito mais que os humanos contemporâneos, como observou Turnbull (The Forest People [1961], The Mountain People [1972]) e Quinn (Ishmael [1992], Beyond Civilization [1999]). Um exemplo clássico e muito citado é o da Confederação dos Iroqueses tomando decisões depois de considerar o impacto que teriam em sete gerações no futuro. Padgett nos fornece uma análise baseada na educação em 2018 (“Sustainability of Education: An Ecopedagogical Approach,” Journal of Sustainability Studies 1(1), Article 5, https://ir.una.edu/sustainabilityjournal/vol1/iss1/5). Claramente, o aprendizado era uma parte importante na vida cotidiana da Confederação dos Iroqueses e de outras sociedades pré-civilizadas. Pelo contrário, as evidências apresentadas aqui indicam que os humanos contemporâneos não aprenderam a praticar ações sustentáveis.

Erva Daninha: Guy, você diz que frear a civilização industrial abruptamente levaria à morte imediata de toda a vida humana na Terra, e talvez de toda forma de vida. Mas deixá-la continuar terá as mesmas consequências, vinte ou trinta anos mais tarde. Então… o que deveríamos fazer? O que você propõe? Qual é a sua postura pessoal a respeito?

Guy McPherson: A certeza da morte, junto com o absurdo da vida, me ajuda a viver com urgência e autenticidade.

Quase todos os dias as pessoas me pedem conselhos sobre como viver. Eu recomendo morar onde você se sinta mais vivo. Recomendo viver plenamente. Recomendo viver com intenção. Recomendo viver com urgência, com a morte em mente. Recomendo a busca da excelência. Recomendo a busca do amor. Não é de surpreender que eu seja frequentemente ridicularizado, alvo de piadas, rechaço e seja isolado por meus próprios contemporâneos na comunidade científica.

Persiga a ação correta. Não se apegue aos resultados. Considerando o pouco de tempo restante em sua vida e na minha, recomendo tudo isso acima, mais do que nunca. Mais intensamente do que você possa imaginar. Para os limites desta cultura restritiva e além. Por você. Por mim. Por nós. Por aqui. Pelo agora. Viva grande. Seja você mesmo, e mais ousado do que nunca. Viva como se estivesse prestes a morrer. O dia se aproxima.

Erva Daninha: Certo! Dr. Guy, agradecemos a oportunidade de entrevistá-lo. Foi um prazer. Se você quiser deixar uma mensagem, sinta-se à vontade para fazê-lo.

Guy McPherson: Agradeço a você. Aprecio a oportunidade de informar as pessoas sobre o mundo que ocupamos.

Notas do Tradutor:

1. NTHE, por suas siglas em inglês (Near-term human extinction).

2. IPCC, por suas siglas em inglês (Intergovernment Panel on Climate Change).

3. Ardil 22 é uma novela satírica antibelicista de ficção histórica escrita por Joseph Heller e publicada em 1961.

(es) [Italia] Nuevo paquete-bomba en Milán

Otro paquete-bomba, idéntico a los enviados a la capital en las últimas semanas, fue entregado el martes por la tarde a un hombre de 59 años de Cologno Monzese, en la provincia de Milán. Mismo papel, mismo contenedor: solo que esta vez el sobre explosivo fue más allá de las fronteras romanas a Lombardía, ya afectado por la emergencia del Coronavirus.

Los carabinieri de Milán, llamados en el acto, lograron detonar el contenido y ahora trabajan junto con los investigadores romanos y antiterroristas para determinar el origen y la posibilidad de que hay detrás de todos los paquetes entregados hasta la fecha en la capital.

Por el momento, la fiscalía de Monza ha abierto un archivo que, con toda probabilidad, será transferido a Roma, donde durante semanas se llevaron a cabo investigaciones sobre los sobres explosivos enviados a una docena de personas. En Piazzale Clodio, se hipotetizan ataques terroristas y lesiones personales. Incluso el último paquete enviado a Lombardía tiene las mismas características que los demás. Para los investigadores romanos, el camino privilegiado sigue siendo algún grupo anárquico.


Recibimos al mail el quinto número de estos cuadernos llamados “Reflexiones Eco-extremistas”, un interesante trabajo teórico que se difunde tanto en inglés como en español. Los números anteriores se pueden encontrar aquí.



Luego de un prolongado tiempo de intervalo respecto a nuestro número anterior, regresamos con las “Reflexiones Eco-extremistas”. En este número 5 nos dedicamos únicamente a recopilar textos escritos por Ramon Elani, una figura cuya relación con el eco-extremismo no es ni mucho menos de afinidad directa y que en tiempos recientes se ha distanciado de forma casi definitiva de los devenires de la tendencia, pero que de todas formas, ha escritos algunas de las piezas más profundas y reflexivas respecto a temas como la arrogancia antropocéntrica del ser humano, la guerra y la violencia o sobre la inconmensurable belleza de la incomprensible naturaleza salvaje, es por eso que decidimos no solo hacer una selección de algunos de sus textos que consideramos de interés para el lector eco-extremista, sino que también nos tomamos la libertad de corregir las traducciones para facilitar su lectura.


1. En lo Lechoso, una tenue extrañeza reside en el camino

2. ¿En que sueña el mundo?

3. El camino de las estrellas violentas

4. El Regreso del Guerrero

5. El Camino del Silencio


[en] (Italy) Presentation manifest: Terroristic Cell “Misanthrope K”

We are a cell of Misanthropes afiliated to the proselitism carried out by projects such as Egoarch Terrorism and others related.

We form this cell, having carried out in the past several arson attacks against machines and social structures that disgust us, explosive devices took too many fingers and limbs, while we buried some sheep who were too much massified. Now we start the path of claiming responsibility with an specific identity, without caring about justice and its servants! see the remains!

“Our” area is “Puglia”. We act in clandestinity in Bari and Lecce, but we want to expand. Total respect for the crime that un Puglia is very spreaded and specially…brutal!

Let’s be clear: Is not a moment for great statements neither to seek something very big.

Death and destruction, that is what matter to us!

Let’s spread active extremist misanthropy and fuck the rest of humanity!

May chaos and terrorism spread, and may we be able to exterminate some human beings…
We are getting our swords and clandestine weapons ready for you all! yes!

Terroristic Cell “Misanthrope K”

Winter, Bari / Lecce

[en] (Greece) Zografou bomb could be linked to new group

17 de diciemrbe 2019

The counterterrorism department of the Greek Police (ELAS) believes the culprits that planted an explosive device across the road from a police precinct next to the campus of the National Technical University of Athens (NTUA) in Zografou, eastern Athens, Monday were young members of anti-establishment groups experimenting with bomb making, possibly linked to a group calling itself the Iconoclastic Sect.

Investigators found significant similarities between the devices wiring with that of an bomb planted by the Sect outside the NTUAs civil engineering department in April 2018.

The same group had planted a bomb outside the Church of Agios Dionysios in Kolonaki, central Athens, in late December last year, which exploded and injured a church employee and a police officer. As with Monday’s incident, there was no warning phone call.

According to police sources, the explosive device in Monday’s attack consisted of gunpowder (of the type used in large firecrackers etc) in a tightly closed metal tube inside a 5-liter plastic container filled with nails. The device had a timer.

Investigators were unable to determine when exactly the perpetrators had planned for the bomb to go off. They believe that the aim was for it to detonate either during the night or in the early morning, but this did not occur due to some kind of fault.

The bomb was found at around 9 a.m. by the police precinct chief, who noticed it as he was parking his motorcycle. A bomb disposal unit destroyed the device in a controlled explosion.

The Iconoclastic Sect has claimed responsibility for a string of attacks since last year. In one of their statements regarding the explosion in Kolonaki last December they bemoaned the fact it did not cause more mayhem. Although the injuries were not serious and [the two wounded] escaped death by chance because the explosion was not as strong as we thought, we learnt our lesson for the next time, the group said at the time.

The text had been published on a Spanish-language website titled Eco-extremist curse (Maldicion Eco-extremista), and members of the group declared themselves members of an international federation of eco-extremists called Individualists Tending toward the Wild (ITS).

[es] (Estados Unidos) 90 Comunicado de ITS

Nuestra sed de sangre ha sido saciada y alabamos a Pan y Dionisos y todo lo Desconocido por guiarnos hacia esta acción. Como los depredadores del bosque, percibimos el aroma de nuestra víctima y actuamos a partir de nuestra hambre por sangre humana. Nos CAGAMOS en toda la moralidad Occidental y todos nuestros detractores anarquistas Americanos. Nos regocijamos con el alzamiento de la muerte misma desde el mundo Submarino como nuestra cómplice personal. Luego de la acción, celebramos, fornicando mientras la dulce sangre de nuestras víctimas seguía fresca en nuestras manos. Deseándole la muerte a toda la civilización, nuestro grupo de extremistas asesinó felizmente a dos tecno-ejecutivos en la Costa Oeste, Tushar Atre y Erin Valenti. Realizamos los asesinatos sin más razón que el simbolismo de ver a dos endebles apéndices del sistema tecno-industrial yaciendo frente a nosotros primero en agonía, y luego inanimados. No nos importó una mierda Atre y su dinero, o sus empleados y como los abusaba. De todos modos, la muy certera fake news correctamente sostiene que ¡se estaba juntando con la gente equivocada! Nos reímos cuando Valenti se excitó por el hecho de ser secuestrada y cuando declaraba ante sus padres haber “despertado” horas antes de su muerte! La Pantera Submarina estuvo complacida por su sacrificio el cual parece haber aceptado.
Nos acercamos hacia ambas víctimas gritando “¡HOKA HEY!” en memoria de nuestros ancestros tribales quienes solo se mantenían como Jefes de Guerra si el balance de cuerpos se sostenía.

¡Por la muerte de todas las civilizaciones!
¡Que el Jaguar Negro se alze desde el mundo submarino para vengar a nuestros ancestros y satisfacer nuestros deseos de sangre humana!
¡Por la unificación de las Individualidades Salvajes!

Individualistas Tendiendo a lo Salvaje-Estados Unidos
La ira de la Naturaleza